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Club Owner | 30103 | Wigan Warriors |
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| Stu M:Mark_P1973:Stu M:
So where do you think you are now? HKR losing the last couple has opened up the race for the LLS again no doubt.
There's just something about Wigan this season to me that seems a bit different. If pushed I still think they'll win the comp but they are heavily reliant on French. Hugely in fact. They are also picking up more injuries it seems now which is natural given the number of games some of the players have played and that fact that Peet doesn't rotate much.
Wigan fans every week keep saying there is nothing to worry about and everything will be fine but then every week of late they have been struggling. I know they came back well against Hudds but am I right in thinking Hudds had no subs for the whole of the 2nd half and lost 2 players to HIA's?
HKR without Lewis have shown that they also suffer badly without their best player and in that sense I feel Saints have coped the best of the lot having lost their best player.
I get also that Wigan have played a number of away games and now have a lot of home games but I can't explain it- they seem well off compared to last season. Stupid in many ways given you may still win the LLS especially if you beat HKR but it seems a strange comp this season.
Like you've said, we are still going to be in the mix, and if i was a betting man, i'd back us to win the big games when it matters Just had a quick look to last season and we had lost 2 games at the same point, but then lost back to back against Hull away and Wire in July and again away to Leeds in August (where we looked shot at to be honest) as thats where we had that run of games to catch up for the WCC. so, we arent too far off points wise, but i think some of our results were more convincing last season KR losing 2 games definitely gets us back in with a chance of LLS, whereas 2 weeks ago after losing to Leigh it looked like being 6 points behind I think the playoffs this season could be very interesting with 5 sides going well (KR, Wigan, Leigh, Saints and Leeds), and all capable of beating each other on a given day. re injuries we've had them in previous seasons, and have had spells with both French and Field out. The challenge for the rest of the team is to step up and ensure we dont miss them, although especially French we all know is capable of something special so difficult to replace that individual brilliance. It looks like we are managing Thompson's game time this year, and with Havard / O'Neill and Miski all coming back from long term injuries, they should all be fresh and fit come the business end of the season. The main concern at the minute is 2nd row where we have been heavily reliant on Faz and Junior, especially with Walters (albeit he's played prop mostly this season) being out, and could provide cover there re Saints, they seem to have quietly crept up on the blind side, and from an outside perspective lots of the Wellens noise has quietened down and with Wigan and KR losing a couple of game probably feel they can have a shot at top 2, if not top spot. Sailor now seems to be producing, but will he retain the FB spot when Welsby is back? Thursday is huge for us. We haven't beaten Wigan, HKR or Leigh for a long time so with the players we will have missing on Thursday, if we manage a win then a tiny part of me will start to think that maybe we can do something with players back from injury. What I will say is that Friday's win was one of our best in a long time, our defence was like the days under Woolf especially with the adversity and disruption of losing two hookers to HIA's. Knowles and Lees were simply incredible, Lees playing 80 mins in the middle in that heat was ridiculous. I also feel that despite the mocking, the "golden generation" of young lads isn't as far fetched as what people think. Whitby, Dagnall, Robertson and Stephens have all showed class at different times. Dagnall hasn't even played 10 SL games yet and looks like he has been playing for years, his try on Friday was superb. Robertson for me is different gravy, I feel he may well go on to be better than Welsby. He's certainly showing a higher ceiling and Welsby wasn't this good at the same age. Welsby also came through as part of the best side in the comp winning games every week. Robertson didn't give Handley a sniff on Friday. Re Sailor I think he will move back to 6 when Welsby returns but who knows who else may be injured by then and there will be very little of the season left when Welsby comes back. He's definitely stepped up in Welsby's absence though. Dagnall has reminded me a bit of when Charnley came in at Wigan. Young but with a good physique, quick, strong and confident. In terms of the golden generation, I don't think there was mocking as such but just a cautionary note that it isn't always as simple as throwing them all in and hoping it works because there are many factors to it. I guess Wellens isn't getting as much personal abuse now? and rightfully so because he is doing a good job with these kids. He is dipping them in and out, isn't throwing them all in together and making sure they don't get over burdened too soon. He would've been called not fit to burn a few weeks ago for Whitby not playing but that looks a wise move and his time will come again pretty soon. There is still work needed on the Saints forward pack for next year and beyond but if they get that right, the backline looks like it will really come together and be as threatening as any across the league. Not aiming this at you at all but the almost bipolar like reactions of some of the Saints fanbase is amusing. During the 4 in a row, some had the Saints team as basically being the World 17 and then when Wigan starting winning things instead, it became toxic and a club legend in Wellens was getting terrorised and now after a few decent wins, it's all rosy again. Saints are doing what Saints always do currently and that is to find a way. It's unbelievable how it always comes together enough to get in the play offs and have a crack at making the Grand Fina, however bad things have got in the weekly rounds. Some of those Saints fans I mention above don't seem to realise what they've got sometimes.
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Club Coach | 1367 | No Team Selected |
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Jul 2005 | 20 years | |
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| Stu M:Phuzzy:I think it's an interesting take to say the "golden generation" tag was mocked Stu. I don't think it was as such. Most people just cautioned against the unreasonable expectations that were being put forward. You mention that 4 appear to be doing well at the moment but that's still a long way from what was being put forward. There are equally as many that haven't gone anywhere near as well, including the 2 Wigan have signed. As I remember it, the overriding opinion was that 2 or 3 regular first team players out of any given age group would be a good return. Anything more, a bonus. As it stands you have 1 regular who gets in above the other options (Robertson) and 3 who get in as cover or rotation. That seems about par to me so far. I do think there is strong evidence that the other 3 could (should already ?) go further up the pecking order but, as with all younger players, there's no guarantee of that. We've all seen players come in with a bang only to fade into obscurity further down the track. For what it's worth, it's good to see young players coming through regardless of the club and I hope all the "golden generation" go on to have good careers... especially the 2 heading this way over the hill  Fair points well made and nice to see you posting again. Stephens and Whitby would be in my first choice 17 and Dagnall has certainly exceeded expectations. I’m not sure what’s going to happen in a couple of weeks time when Murphy is fit. I really rate Murphy and I think he’s done well. He has a lot of attributes, unfortunately as expected I guess, he’s picked up injuries which was always the risk. It’s Dagnalls shirt to lose and I think it would be harsh to drop him for Murphy because he’s done nothing wrong and performed really well I watched the STS- Rhinos game on Saturday, it was the first time I had seen Dagnall, I’m surprised he has not been in the team more. Looks physically ready for SL
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| Stu M:Phuzzy:I think it's an interesting take to say the "golden generation" tag was mocked Stu. I don't think it was as such. Most people just cautioned against the unreasonable expectations that were being put forward. You mention that 4 appear to be doing well at the moment but that's still a long way from what was being put forward. There are equally as many that haven't gone anywhere near as well, including the 2 Wigan have signed. As I remember it, the overriding opinion was that 2 or 3 regular first team players out of any given age group would be a good return. Anything more, a bonus. As it stands you have 1 regular who gets in above the other options (Robertson) and 3 who get in as cover or rotation. That seems about par to me so far. I do think there is strong evidence that the other 3 could (should already ?) go further up the pecking order but, as with all younger players, there's no guarantee of that. We've all seen players come in with a bang only to fade into obscurity further down the track. For what it's worth, it's good to see young players coming through regardless of the club and I hope all the "golden generation" go on to have good careers... especially the 2 heading this way over the hill  Fair points well made and nice to see you posting again. Stephens and Whitby would be in my first choice 17 and Dagnall has certainly exceeded expectations. I’m not sure what’s going to happen in a couple of weeks time when Murphy is fit. I really rate Murphy and I think he’s done well. He has a lot of attributes, unfortunately as expected I guess, he’s picked up injuries which was always the risk. It’s Dagnalls shirt to lose and I think it would be harsh to drop him for Murphy because he’s done nothing wrong and performed really well I watched the STS- Rhinos game on Saturday, it was the first time I had seen Dagnall, I’m surprised he has not been in the team more. Looks physically ready for SL
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Player Coach | 5564 | Wigan Warriors |
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Nov 2006 | 19 years | |
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| Stu M:Phuzzy:I think it's an interesting take to say the "golden generation" tag was mocked Stu. I don't think it was as such. Most people just cautioned against the unreasonable expectations that were being put forward. You mention that 4 appear to be doing well at the moment but that's still a long way from what was being put forward. There are equally as many that haven't gone anywhere near as well, including the 2 Wigan have signed. As I remember it, the overriding opinion was that 2 or 3 regular first team players out of any given age group would be a good return. Anything more, a bonus. As it stands you have 1 regular who gets in above the other options (Robertson) and 3 who get in as cover or rotation. That seems about par to me so far. I do think there is strong evidence that the other 3 could (should already ?) go further up the pecking order but, as with all younger players, there's no guarantee of that. We've all seen players come in with a bang only to fade into obscurity further down the track. For what it's worth, it's good to see young players coming through regardless of the club and I hope all the "golden generation" go on to have good careers... especially the 2 heading this way over the hill  Fair points well made and nice to see you posting again. Stephens and Whitby would be in my first choice 17 and Dagnall has certainly exceeded expectations. I’m not sure what’s going to happen in a couple of weeks time when Murphy is fit. I really rate Murphy and I think he’s done well. He has a lot of attributes, unfortunately as expected I guess, he’s picked up injuries which was always the risk. It’s Dagnalls shirt to lose and I think it would be harsh to drop him for Murphy because he’s done nothing wrong and performed really well I actually wrote a long reply to one of your previous posts only to see it completely disappear when I pressed send! This site has been hit or miss like that for a while which is why I haven't been posting much. Hopefully it's settling down a little as more people seem to be posting more regularly recently. Fingers crossed.. I agree that Stephens and Dagnall look ready but I'm less convinced about Whitby yet. Watching him last night he looked overawed and pressured far too easily and his seeming lack of pace means he can't afford to be pressured in that way. Harry Smith isn't blessed with pace but seems to have all the time in the world on the ball. Whitby is very young so could quite easily get there too but I don't think he is yet (in order to be your regular starter) or that it's a foregone conclusion that he will do. I think your desire to see him as a regular starter is more to do with Saint's poor options in the halves than anything to do with standout talent on Whitby's part. If he was behind Smith, for example, I doubt there'd be much clamour for him to be playing regularly. On Robertson, btw, I said above that he is the one that looks to be there on merit. I'd like to temper that slightly and say "but not at centre". He's all class but was really exposed last night against Niu. He's been drafted into the England squad but can you imagine him there against the Aussies? It would be carnage! I think he's a massive talent but would like to see him in his more natural positions of fullback or stand off.
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Club Coach | 9732 | Wigan Warriors |
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Feb 2005 | 20 years | |
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| Even as a Wigan fan, I wanted more out of St Helens last night. They're known for being a flamboyant, exciting attacking side but last night was painfully formulaic and repetitive. The 'Lee Briers' effect has been a myth thus far.
I think Super League in general is in dire need of more innovation and variety within attacking structures.
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International Star | 4828 | Wigan Warriors |
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Jan 2015 | 11 years | |
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| I watched the Saints/Leeds game last night and thought they played pretty well against an enthusiastic Rhinos team who just made too many errors. And Dagnell looked good. But much less impressive against Leigh, where lack of firepower in attack really hurt them.
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