Agree with most of this selection, but would not have coley as the water boy, imo he plyed ok last season in parts to ensure he got his extension the went back to his normal self,



Baliey was worth the extension so long as he keeps the pen count down!!



imo O Carrol will never be what we need him to be .

Bailey will be in the first 13.



Phelps,

Roberts, Gleeson, Carmont, Richards,

S Tomkins, Leuluai,

Fielden, Riddell, Coley,

Hansen, Bailey,

O'Loughlin.



Prescott, Feka, J Tomkins, Deacon,

Goulding, Pryce, O'Carroll, McIlorum,

Mossop, Ainscough, Farrell, Mellor.



I don't think the first 13 will be changed around much but the 14-25 will be the interesting bit. Deacon will be used from the bench I'm sure during the early part of the season interchanging with Sam & Tommy.

Also under the SC which covers the highest paid 25 players we have 23 with first team rugby, just two who have not.

That seems a very deep and experienced squad for next year.

Some really tough choices to make for next season, personally:



1. Phelps

2. Robers

3. Gleeson

4. Carmont

5. Richards

6. S Tomkins

7. Deacon

8. Fielden

9. Riddell

10. Prescott

11. Hansen

12. Bailey

13. O'Loughlin



14. Leuluai

15. Coley

16. J. Tomkins

17. Feka



I'd also completely eliminate the 20 minute by the clock interchanges, and interchange when needed.



The biggest difficulty for me is trying to find game time for: McIlorum, Goulding, Pryce, Ainscough, Mossop, O'Carroll as they all need it. Players like Farrell, Thornley etc I think the odd SL game next season is sufficient but the aforementioned all I feel need more extensive game time and are far too developed already for the U20's and i'm not sure how many overage pllayers are allowed anyway.



Pryce is 23 (24 in July), O'Carroll is 22 (23 in June), Ainscough is 20, Goulding is 21 (22 in March), McIlorum is 21 (22 in January), Mossop is 20 (21 in January) they're all at the ages where they need some significant game time.

Pat Richards was poor playing under Millward at centre in a team falling apart. When Noble arrived and played him on the wing his form was good enough to make it hard for Dallas to get back in the side. Like the rest of the team there was nothing wrong with Richards form by the end of the 2006 season.



Roberts did not have to put up with Millward or playing out of position so I really wish people would stop using Richards mythical poor first season as a pointer to Roberts getting better or as an excuse for Roberts in 2009. If he gets better it will be because he applies himself better and responds to the new coaching set up, which is true for several players IMO.



Dave

I don't really see the problems people have with him, he always appears generally solid to me, and the best finisher we have had for a few years when he can be ar$ed.

You've just named 2 problems there:



1. 'He appears generally solid' - Is this good enough for an overseas player? Wasn't Colbon 'solid'? Surely the idea of bringing in a player from Australia/New Zealand is to play in a position that we can't fill in with someone from our Reserve side or there is no British alternative (all of the right quality). So, with this in mind, I expect overseas players to be one of the best players in the team and one of the best players, in their position, in Super League, all to compensate taking up a Quota spot, usually a high wage and for keeping out a British alternative.



2. 'When he can be ar$ed'. Harsh comment IMO, but a silly one to make when you earlier say you can't see the problem.

Seriously I don't know what people were expecting last season. You could've put Jesus Christ on our right wing and he wouldn't have shined. He started off quiet and picked up as he settled in and our team got a bit more likely to take the ball to the right. His metres per carry, tackle busts, clean breaks, tackles, try assists, and even trys were all pretty respectable (go compare them with Pat's who had the advantage of far more ball - 167 more carries) if you don't believe it.

I've got £5 ready to put on Roberts for top try scorer next season

Roberts did well last season.



I don't care what you know who is upset about because it's unfair to use this or that scenario to praise Roberts, he doesn't mind using stats or scenarios to meet his agenda when it suits!



Top line?



Anyone want a bet that Roberts is selected by Maguire & Wane on the Vast Majority of occasions (If Not Injured obviously!) next season?





?



If they do select him then how will they explain away Roberts inclusion then? Last season it was only because Noble wouldn't pick kids

(Ludicrous statement I know but some people still believe it as they are brainwashed by certain posters constant whining about it!) rather than what to many believe is the real reason for his inclusion, and I Know this may sound radical, He's the best Right Winger we have!!!!!!!!!!!



IMHO, a couple of players have been over criticised for the sole purpose of using them as a Proverbial stick to beat Noble with by a few supporters who Think they know better then the coach at the time!



If Maguire does very well you can bet most of this will go away, if he does average or struggles the same old arguments will come up!

Correct!



His defensive positioning for short kicks near the line, kick return downfield and his overall defensive positioning was very good for the vast majority of the time, far better than what we have had for some years.



I will say, just to prove that i'm not like certain posters who only use points to try and prove their point in an argument, that on certain individual occasions (Probably 2 or 3 over the year) he has, through his defensive style of coming up quick to pick his man when needed, has allowed his winger to get outside him.



To counter that, I believe he saved us on many,many more times through his positioning and defensive efforts.



On attack I agree that he could "Look" a bit more interested however i'm with SEB (And not just by use of stats but with my own eyes) and can see that when he does take the ball up from AHB he makes good yards, he is deceptively strong in the tackle and nearly always gets on the front foot for a PTB and I don't remember him bombing too many chances last season?



Then again if you want to look at ANY player and criticise to try and prove YOUR point you can do.

FWIW I don't have [ithat much[/i of a problem with Amos Roberts. He had a slow start to the season, but so did the vast majority of the team. I would like to see him strike up a better partnership and develop a greater understanding with Martin Gleeson than he did last season. He can obviously finish tries well, he is the first winger we have had since Brett Dallas to back himself and dive in the corner. My only concern with Amos Roberts is the length of his contract. Four years is a hefty contract to be handing out to an overseas player (or any player for that matter) and I just fear that with the quota coming down and with players like Ainscough, Charnley coming through, he might prove to be a costly signing - both on the salary cap and the impact he will have on keeping young lads out the side. Plus I would imagine he will lose some of his speed as he gets older. So for those reasons (through no fault of his own) I see him as a bad signing.

Still not enough for what people are saying about him imo. I didn't mean he didn't have problems, all players do, I meant I didn't see why people hated him so much. I believe he wasn't trying as hard as he could have in attack because we have seen what he can do with tight spaces on occasion, but not always, and a big sign of whether you want the ball or not is how far away from his centre he liked to stand. Just because you are a winger does mean you have to hug the touchline most of the time. And as for why he was brought in over Colbon, I don't know, I don't make the decisions, and I said he was generally solid in the sense that he does not make mistakes that often, but when he does make mistakes - again like everyone does - it is far less often than most other players on our team, it is just picked up upon. I see being "solid" as a big bonus in our quite young squad, sometimes you need the solid players, even if they are from overseas, and it is the fact that he has been solid that I would still rate him above Ainscough, but I would like him to stick a bit closer to his centre.



Man that went in circles, but I hope I at least clarified what I meant there?